Snow Journal - Serious About Snowsports!

Home

Forums : NELSAP Discussion : NELSAP Discussion
Moderated by: Chris, nelsap, Betsy, the_hop

Anonymous posts are not allowed in this forum

Jay Cut Update 10/10/07

Page: 1

Author	Post
Betsy Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Sep 04, 2001 Posts: 1872 Location:Burlington Area, VT	Posted: Oct 10, 2007 - 12:29 PM GMT Jay Cut Update

roger47 Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Feb 21, 2007 Posts: 860 Location:	Posted: Oct 10, 2007 - 12:56 PM GMT Thanks for the update Betsy. What a pair of chuckleheads.

rstuthill Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Apr 03, 2005 Posts: 1631 Location:Bolton, CT	Posted: Oct 10, 2007 - 1:49 PM GMT Quote: Thanks for the update Betsy. What a pair of chuckleheads. Woodchucks.

jb66 Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Jun 24, 2004 Posts: 1303 Location:	Posted: Oct 10, 2007 - 2:11 PM GMT Maybe the 'task of keeping skiers out of the area' should be left to the guys that cut the trees- make them stand at the access point and shoo people away, then hike back up to the tram for the ride down at the end of the day

chfriend Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: May 17, 2007 Posts: 421 Location:Central MA	Posted: Oct 10, 2007 - 2:55 PM GMT Screw that! Make them walk down themselves, no tram for you! __________ Just in case it's not dead yet, keep hitting it with a stick, maybe throw a few rocks at it, urinate on it... You know, the whole ball of wax...

telemark Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Aug 03, 2004 Posts: 153 Location:Arlington, MA	Posted: Oct 11, 2007 - 5:59 PM GMT There's a work trip coming up on Sunday for those interested in helping out. I believe the majority of the work will be building water bars and spreading ground cover. I don't know if they will be placing signs or ropes at this point. Click on the link below for details. There's a showing of PW07 - the latest movie from our friends at Powder Whore - at the Regent Theatre in Arlington MA next Wed at 7:30. There will be a raffle for many great prizes (including a Jay Season's Pass, and two pairs of ski) after the showing. For more information - Click Here -dave-

joshua segal Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Jul 12, 2004 Posts: 4270 Location:NH	Posted: Oct 11, 2007 - 6:12 PM GMT The last paragraph of the article says: Quote: Another hearing has been set for November 13th. In the meantime, Fish and Wildlife officials are faced with the task of keeping skiers out of the area this winter. This might be an interesting subject to follow as the snow hits. My guess is that the same scofflaw-types who would make such a cut, would also remove any "signs" indicating "keep off" and the cost of keeping powder starved skiers off such an inviting slope by having a human presence nearby would be daunting! __________ Joshua Segal

telemark Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Aug 03, 2004 Posts: 153 Location:Arlington, MA	Posted: Oct 11, 2007 - 6:24 PM GMT Based on the way the cut was laid out (horribly) I suspect things will turn into a luge chute soon after any real snow. Skiing in the trees is likely to be a better run anyways; that cut won't hold snow. Then there's the avalanche danger of an unstabilized slope like that. Yes, signs may be removed, but the folks who go back there a lot are pretty pissed off about this as well. Once replanting is underway it'll hopefully be less of an issue. -dave-

treebeard Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Jan 08, 2005 Posts: 589 Location:	Posted: Oct 11, 2007 - 7:46 PM GMT In vermont it is unconstitutional to restrict resident's access to state lands. No law can be enacted to do so. If people want to ride that horror show they will. There is nothing the state can do. Even if they issue fines or make arrests, nothing will stick due to the constitutionality of the issue. The snow that covers the cut will be the very thing that makes descending it constitutional since the layer of snow protects the plants below it. This is the same reason snow machines are allowed in some very remote and wild areas, why climbers are allowed to climb and why nordic skiers can ski. And no one will know how bad, or good that cut is, until it fills in and it gets some descents. For not wanting people up there, they sure have put the info out there. __________ Embrace that which you fear

telemark Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Aug 03, 2004 Posts: 153 Location:Arlington, MA	Posted: Oct 11, 2007 - 9:18 PM GMT Quote: In vermont it is unconstitutional to restrict resident's access to state lands. No law can be enacted to do so. If people want to ride that horror show they will. There is nothing the state can do. Even if they issue fines or make arrests, nothing will stick due to the constitutionality of the issue. Do you have a citation to support that? I couldn't find the appropriate part of the State Constitution but I may have been looking for the wrong terms. If there is something in state constitution I would hope there are exceptions allowed for conservation, resource protection and safety. I'm not saying that they will attempt anything like that, but I don't see anything preventing it.

Jimme Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Jan 25, 2002 Posts: 1030 Location:6 miles West of Jiminy Peak, MA	Posted: Oct 12, 2007 - 8:50 PM GMT Amazing how much got done before they got "caught". That had to be a tremendous effort if they did not use any chainsaws! Plus hauling the downed trees out of the way. So what will the State do; have someone sit each day to make sure no one uses the illegal run? Once trees get replanted, the State will most likely have the right to section it off as a re-forestation area. While I can't agree it's OK to go in the woods and chop down trees, I realize this is being done all over the country at some ski areas. MRG comes to mind; where there is some cutting done but not enough to show a clear trail. We really do have enough ski areas on the planet. Especially here in the East you can get to any area within a 6 hour drive. There's really no need for more trails. __________ Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened.

telemark Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Aug 03, 2004 Posts: 153 Location:Arlington, MA	Posted: Oct 12, 2007 - 10:56 PM GMT Edited: Oct 12, 2007 - 10:56 PM GMT These guys used chainsaws, and cut some trees up to a foot in diameter. No one does that anywhere in New England that I'm aware of. People prune in many places, and at places like MRG they have authorized worktrips to prune. That's also private land, this was public land without any significant development. The reason this is getting so much attention is that it is so far outside the norm and could have some fairly severe long term erosion and environmental effects. It will need some time to re-vegetate; I'm not sure how the GMC plans to achieve this.

treebeard Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Jan 08, 2005 Posts: 589 Location:	Posted: Oct 12, 2007 - 11:27 PM GMT "without any significant development" Are you shittin' me? There is a SKI AREA right next to this cut. I think that qualifies as "significant development". What is more, is that the "significant development" it sits near, is THE SAME TYPE as the offending deed. The only difference is that the State of Vermont didn't get any $, and they can't figure out how to charge for it. Environmental impact studies? Yeah right. The Ski Area says where they want to cut a new trail: the state says how much: they cut the trail. It ain't about the environment or delicate habitat any more than the Iraq war is about "freeing Iraqis". It's about $. It's about class. Let's get our heads out of the sand (mine too!). __________ Embrace that which you fear

telemark Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Aug 03, 2004 Posts: 153 Location:Arlington, MA	Posted: Oct 13, 2007 - 4:02 AM GMT Let's just agree to disagree, OK? -dave-

treebeard Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Jan 08, 2005 Posts: 589 Location:	Posted: Oct 13, 2007 - 12:35 PM GMT I think we DO agree on one level; they shouldn't have done it. Why it was wrong, well, that's where we differ. __________ Embrace that which you fear

telemark Profile \| Galleries Rank: Member Since: Aug 03, 2004 Posts: 153 Location:Arlington, MA	Posted: Oct 13, 2007 - 1:37 PM GMT Quote: I think we DO agree on one level; they shouldn't have done it. Why it was wrong, well, that's where we differ. I can live with that.

Page: 1